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Lacplesis
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[*] posted on 4/24/2009 at 07:23
Holiday postcard rates question


I can't find any details about the 1 kop holiday rate for postcards.
Please anyone be so kind to help me out with following information:
In what period was the 1 kop pc holiday rate effective. It ended 1914 I assume?

On what holidays the rate was in effect?

New Year
Easter
Pentecost
Christmas

Any else?

thx for your input!
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jlechtanski
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[*] posted on 4/24/2009 at 07:51


Are you, by any chance, referring to the 1k printed-matter rate for local greeting postcards with up to 5 words of written greeting?

I know that the rate was set to 5k on 1 Dec 1915.
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Lacplesis
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[*] posted on 4/24/2009 at 08:59


Well, yes and no...

In my collection the printed-matter rate greeting cards are all redesignated as "printed-matter" in script or with a rubber stamp.
Non of my holiday 1kop pc's is changed in that way.
(Or is this just coincidence?)
I also remember to have seen reverence on a special holiday postcard (not printed-matter) rate, but can't remember the source.
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jlechtanski
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[*] posted on 4/24/2009 at 13:08


Do any of your 1k greeting postcards NOT endorsed "printed matter" have more that 5 written words of greeting?

That might indicate a different rate class -- or just an item not charged postage due.
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Gary
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[*] posted on 4/24/2009 at 13:57


Maybe a few examples could be posted for us to see? Are all the "holiday" PCs from/to the same city or different from and to locations?
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Alep
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[*] posted on 4/27/2009 at 07:47


In the 1st decade of 1900's (I do not know the exact date), it was permitted to send postcards with greetings up to 5 words (Christmas, Easter, Birthday etc) franked according to the printed matter rate in force (1 k local, 2 k inland). Sometimes, the senders wrote on these postcatds "Pechatnoe" (printed matter) or "Pozdravitel'noe" (greeting) but it was not necessary or obligatory. I show here two examples randomly picked out of many such items.
In 1915, this practize was abolished because of the post was overloaded with the mail to and from Active Army, and such greeting postcards were ordered to prepay as letters (5 k and 10 k, respectively), otherwise they were to be destroyed. The new set of postal rates introduced as from 15 August 1917 provided for such cards franking according to the ordinary letter rate (10 k and 15 k, respectively).

-971.jpg - 157kB
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Gary
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[*] posted on 4/28/2009 at 17:14


Quote: Originally posted by Gary  
Maybe a few examples could be posted for us to see? Are all the "holiday" PCs from/to the same city or different from and to locations?


I'm not sure we have closed this discussion with facts. There must be something in the literature that tells us about this. Are your examples different from that shown by Alep?:(
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Lacplesis
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[*] posted on 4/28/2009 at 17:42


I will check out my postcards and post them as soon as I find the time.
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jlechtanski
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[*] posted on 4/29/2009 at 10:43


I have never seen the exact date when this "greeting rate" was established. The original post office rate notice, if it exists, would be invaluable.

It may go back to the printed matter rates of 19 Mar 1899 setting it at 1k up to 1 lot (local) and 2k per 8 lots.

What is the earliest known usage?
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Alep
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[*] posted on 5/2/2009 at 11:27


The undoubtedly earliest usage I found in my collection is the New Year greeting postcard sent at the end of December 1903 from Ruen to Pernov.

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Alep
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[*] posted on 5/2/2009 at 11:29


There are few words on the reverse and the picture speaks for itself. The inscription "pechatnoe" was not necessary.

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Alep
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[*] posted on 5/2/2009 at 11:34


I have a little later postcard with Easter greetings posted locally at Valk in March 1904 and franked accordingly. However, it was charged with the double deficiency to the normal 3-kop postcard rate. This looks very strange. The sender could learn of the privileged rate e.g. from a newspaper. And was the postal clerk ignorant of it?

-979.jpg - 83kB
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Alep
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[*] posted on 5/2/2009 at 11:38


The reverse.
Anyway, we could regard 1903 provisionally as the earliest date. From this year on, there are found such greeting postcards franked according to the printed matter rate up to the early 1915.

-980.jpg - 104kB
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Gary
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[*] posted on 5/2/2009 at 13:45


Quote: Originally posted by Lacplesis  
I can't find any details about the 1 kop holiday rate for postcards.
Please anyone be so kind to help me out with following information:
In what period was the 1 kop pc holiday rate effective. It ended 1914 I assume?

On what holidays the rate was in effect?

New Year
Easter
Pentecost
Christmas

Any else?

thx for your input!


Not sure if this is what you mean, but here is info from a document published in May 1899 that uses the words for holiday-type cards.




Attachment: 1899 ref to cards.pdf (279kB)
This file has been downloaded 561 times

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jlechtanski
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[*] posted on 5/2/2009 at 19:25


Looks like a winner.

I see what look like the sender is authorized to add "congratulatory inscriptions" but not more than five words. Some holidays are listed as an example.

The fact that the book was published in May 1899 makes me think it was copied from the postal regulations that set the printed matter rates of 19 Mar 1899.

Nice find.


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Lacplesis
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[*] posted on 5/3/2009 at 04:50


Indeed a nice find! My russian is not good enough to get the full meaning, but I will ask my wife to get me a translation from one of her school-classes russian parents.
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Gary
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[*] posted on 5/3/2009 at 07:08


As a short follow-on, the 1-kop rate was not a holiday rate. Prior to 1899, a special 1-kop rate was in effect for banderol (wrapper) mail within the cities. This rate also applied to the visit cards sent locally. My guess is that the 1-kop rate for cards with less than 5 words, such as holiday greetings, came into being after Russia started allowing picture postcards. At some point in time, the 'for holidays such as...' words were dropped and everything became a printed matter or pechatnoe item. There is a very brief article on these pechatnoe items at
http://www.rossica.org/Members/Articles/Articles/combs/print...
:)


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jlechtanski
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[*] posted on 5/3/2009 at 10:21


From the Universal Postal Convention, Washington, 15 June 1897 (entry into force generally 1 January 1899)

Article XVIII 4(b) To add in manuscript, on printed visiting cards, the address of the sender, his title, as well as good wishes, congratulations, thanks, condolences or other formulas of courtesy, expressed in five words at most or by means of conventional initials (p. f. &c);

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jlechtanski
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[*] posted on 5/3/2009 at 11:31


From the Universal Postal Convention, Rome, 26 May 1906

Article XIX 3(b) to add in manuscript, on printed visiting cards and also on Christmas and New Year cards the address of the sender, his title, as well as good wishes, congratulations, thanks, condolences or other formulas of courtesy, expressed in five words at most or by means of conventional initials (p. f., &c);
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Gary
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[*] posted on 5/3/2009 at 12:52


The UPU Conventions clearly cover the International use. There was a short article in Rossica #133 about the International Collector Societies. Members who exchanged picture postcards took advantage of the lower postage rate.
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jlechtanski
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[*] posted on 5/3/2009 at 16:10


Clearly UPU conventions influence domestic mail regulations as well.

Compare:

“good wishes, congratulations, thanks, condolences or other formulas of courtesy, expressed in five words at most“

with

“выражать пожелания, поздравления, благодарности, сочувствия и прочая вежливости, сделанная однако же не более, как в пяти словах”

taken from the Pamyatnaya Kniga. Virtually identical.
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Gary
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[*] posted on 5/3/2009 at 17:21


I did not say it did and I did not say it did not. However, the thread is all about the 1-kop rate. Maybe we need a separate thread to cover the 2-kop rate? I doubt the Russians would allow a foreign element to dictate what they did internally. However, for mail going to and from external countries is another matter.:)
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jlechtanski
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[*] posted on 5/3/2009 at 18:52


The wording of the Pamyatnaya Kniga applies to the 1k intracity (local) rate as well as the intercity (internal) and international rates.

I wouldn't make sense to define "manuscript greetings" differently for domestic and international banderol. Unneccesarily complex. They simply used the UPU terminology.

Since we don't have the Russian regulations, it's a starting point to understanding what's going on.

Still unanswered: Was "printed matter / banderol" required to be written/printed on these items.



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Gary
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[*] posted on 5/4/2009 at 17:22


It would be nice if someone with access to the literature in Russia or a former republic would visit their library or state archives and provide more information. I would if I could. Almost seems like there is no information available sometimes in the only place the information could be found.:hop
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Gary
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[*] posted on 5/5/2009 at 16:42


Quote: Originally posted by Lacplesis  
I will check out my postcards and post them as soon as I find the time.


Looking forward to seeing what started this thread. :)
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