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Author: Subject: Opinion Please, Genuine or Fake.
msmike
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[*] posted on 6/6/2007 at 18:40
Opinion Please, Genuine or Fake.


Sometimes we are all put into the position of wondering if a used Scot 39 or 40 is a forgery. I submit this one to you for your opinion. I have my opinion but let's see how you would determine if it were genuine or a fake. It may be a good summary for a future article in the bulletin. ;)

Scott 40 Used.jpg - 77kB
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mvarfolo
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[*] posted on 6/6/2007 at 19:32


Is there a larger scan and scan of the back, or the challenge is to decipher from what's viewable? ;)
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msmike
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[*] posted on 6/6/2007 at 20:33


You asked for it and you have it except for the back. The back is not revelant. It is on vertical laid watermark paper.

Scott 40 Used Enlarged.jpg - 245kB
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David Jay
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[*] posted on 6/6/2007 at 23:29


Ah, but the back may be quite relevant -- a) some of the fakes are on laid paper with the wrong distance between the line, b) sometimes the watermark is
drawn in with a wax pencil (in which case it disappears in watermark fluid, rather than becoming more obvious), and c) at least with the related Finish stamps that are also often faked, the laid paper may have western rather than cyrillic letters. Also, check the perforation very carefully.
However, most fakes of this stamp I've seen are not in this kind of rough shape.
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mvarfolo
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[*] posted on 6/7/2007 at 11:18


The back obviously has no glue, washed off, so the imprint of the eagle and posthorns should be quite visible.
I was hoping that the alterations, if any, from the version with thunderbolts will be more visible from the back. Just one of the many ways to look at this stamp, may be?

This stamp was bought recently on german ebay, was it not?
Just curious....:)
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msmike
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[*] posted on 6/10/2007 at 12:17


The laid paper is as it should be and there is no sign of any thunderbolts. Due to the cancellation, the posthorn is quite visable from the front. This stamp was found in an old box I had that I bought many years ago that I thought was just a bunch of used worthless material left over from what I was really buying. Much to my surprise, I found this. But there is enough ink to make it difficult to be sure if it is genuine or a forgery. So I ask for your help.

And thought I might make a Bulletin article out of how you determine this. Already you have given me some good input but now I need more. Keep it up.
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David Jay
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[*] posted on 6/10/2007 at 19:15


The posthorns look to be the right size for Sc #40, so it is not a later issue with
thunderbolts somehow obscured. Fakes usually look better!
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jlechtanski
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[*] posted on 6/12/2007 at 13:43


Here is a seller who asks if it is a Michel 30y or Michel 45 “gestempelt”

http://cgi.ebay.de/123-RUSSLAND-1884-Mi-Nr-39-y-oder-45-gest...

You can clearly see that it is the smaller posthorn.

Also, I might mention the Fournier forgeries with the Riga and Moscow postmarks.

Lobachevski mentions forgeries of the 3r50k and 7r made to defraud the post office. Specifically he mentions two types of the 3r50k.
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